Tiffen: Extraordinary Images with Water White Glass
When I was doing a Canon 5D film test in January of 2010, I put eight Canon 5Ds in a line for this cool action camera array. When I started screwing Neutral Density filters onto all of the cameras to get the same stop, I noticed that when the eight cameras were side by side. The color on every camera was different.
I quickly pulled all the filtration off each camera and stopped down the exposure. All the cameras’ colors matched. It was the ND filters. So, I looked at the filters that I had in my inventory. I realized to avoid the green/brown muddy look, the filters had to be designed for the color space.
Filters Tailored for the Canon 5D Color Space
I called Steve Tiffen, whom I had met at several ASC functions. I asked if he was willing to make a set of filters tailored to the Canon 5D color space.
Demonstrating Tiffen filters at HDSLR Bootcamp 2010
Tiffen filters at HDSLR Bootcamp 2010
With the limits of an 8 BIT color space, you need to get the image close to the look of the final product. The best comparison that I can make is to treat the Canon platform like reversal film stock.
Results from many tests revealed that the brown and green mud colors were baked in with the ND filters. So, they were difficult to get rid of in the color correction process. After collaborating with Tiffen, we came up with a new set of Neutral Density filters that deliver the cleanest image for post-color grading.
Water White Neutral Density Filters
These are Water White Neutral Density filters that are very easy to use. We have designed 4 kits for both the novice and professional. They come in two sizes 77mm and 4 x 5. Tiffen has engineered them to give you 7 stops worth of ND so that you can shoot the Canon 5D in the blazing sun at F 2.0 if you would like.
Since the invention of the Arri Alexa, Water White ND glass is engineered to go to 10 stops, which will be essential for shooting with the Alexa’s base ISO at 800.
Tiffen filters at HDSLR Bootcamp 2010
Why Neutral Density?
The biggest reason is that you have a vista vision sensor in a 5D. Three reasons that the HD image looks so great right out of this camera are the sensor, the color space, and the ability to use shallow depth of field. You achieve it by using ND outside.
It takes something that at an F 11 looks like video and drops the f-stop down to an F 2.8, which makes the resulting image look like digital film. Depth of field is a very powerful cinematic tool and these filters give you this ability and your cleanest image in post.
Here are the Tiffen Image Makers HV Filter Kit Series WW ND filter packs.
The Indie
77mm WW Neutral Density, this gives you four stops worth of ND.
.3, .6, .9, 1.2 with a 4 carrying case that attaches to your belt for easy access.
The Indie Plus
77mm WW Neutral Density, this gives you another 3 stops worth of ND plus a circular pola. With both kits together, you will have 7 stops worth of ND.
1.5, 1.8, 2.1, and a circular Pola with a carrying case that attaches to your belt for easy access.
The Pro
4 x 5 WW Neutral Density, this set gives you the Panavision size and 4 stops worth of ND
.3, .6, .9, 1.2 with a carrying case that attaches to your belt with pull tabs that slide each filter right up into your hands for quick filter changes.
The Pro Plus
4 x 5 WW Neutral Density, this set gives you the Panavision size and 3 more stops worth of ND with a 138mm circular pola. With both kits together you will have 7 stops worth of ND.
1.5, 1.8, 2.1, 138mm circular pola with a carrying case that attaches to your belt with pull tabs that slide each filter right up into your hands for quick filter changes.
These kits are available at:
B&H at the links above
And other authorized Tiffen dealers.
Schedule 1-on-1 Video Call with Shane Hurlbut, ASC
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About Filmmakers Academy Cinematographer Mentor Shane Hurlbut, ASC
Director of photography Shane Hurlbut, ASC works at the forefront of cinema. He’s a storyteller, innovator, and discerning collaborator, who brings more than three decades of experience to his art. He is a member of the American Society of Cinematographers, the International Cinematographers Guild/Local 600, and The Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences.
Hurlbut frequently joins forces with great directors: McG’s Netflix Rim of the World and The Babysitter, plus Warner Bros. We Are Marshall and Terminator: Salvation; Scott Waugh’s Need for Speed and Act of Valor; and Gabriele Muccino’s There Is No Place Like Home and Fathers and Daughters. His additional film credits include Semi-Pro; The Greatest Game Ever Played; Into the Blue; Mr 3000; Drumline; 11:14, which earned Hurlbut a DVDX nomination; and The Skulls. Notably, his television credits include the first season of AMC’s Into the Badlands.
I’ve had a lot of challenges with shooting aerials with the 5D. I need to shoot video and stills and the form factor of a stripper model is ideal in the cockpit. I like to shoot stills with a 24-70 2.8. It gives me tack sharp images but, I have to be really close to the jet we’re chasing and positioned 90° to the canopy I’m shooting through to avoid distortion. I love the video images I get with the 5D but switching between video and stills has been giving me mixed results. I set up the camera to shoot video in manual – 1/50th ISO 160 and switch to TV for stills at 1/500th. With a ND filter (.9) the stills are sometimes coming out too dark. I say sometimes because I’m not getting consistency in identical situations. I’ve also tried flying with a 70-200 2.8 which is great for video because it’s easier to track my target when I can get a little farther away but the stills look like crap. Shooting video with a Sony EX1 is a lot more forgiving and I find myself going back to that more and more. Yesterday I flew with the EX1 and had the 5D strapped to my G-suit. I didn’t use the 5D for video at all though I wish I had when we started pulling 6-7Gs. I’ll definitely be purchasing the Indie & Indie Plus when they’re available. I’m going to keep experimenting until I get something I can trust. Having a camera this small with this image quality (and the ability to shoot stills) has been a blessing and a headache. Is it too early to put in a deposit for the next Bootcamp?
Hi Shane,
I’m currently struggling to decide between 77mm screw on filters and 4×4 filters for my matte box. The thing about getting 4×4 is i can then use it on other cameras, but 77mm is more practical for the 5D. The other problem is i have Leica glass and their screw rings can be unusual sizes so step up rings are harder to find. My question… Where did you get your step up rings from for your Leica’s, did you have any trouble getting the 77mm ND’s to go on the Leica’s? I have Leica 19mm Version 2, 35mm F2, 50mm F2, 80mm 1.4 at the moment.
My other question is if you think IR ND is absolutely necessary? I’m currently planning on getting non IR ND since i can’t afford two sets of ND at the moment.
Any help you can offer is much appreciated.
Thanks so much for all the hard work you’re putting in Shane!
K Wasley
Matt, forget shutter priority mode (TV). Just go manual, which is totally compatible with ND filters – at least that’s my setup. The in camera metering and live histograms will get you where you need to go within a shot or two. That and never, repeat with me, never shoot in JPEG only. RAW will give you about plus/minus a stop to play with in post. The Canon DPP software also allows you to tweak the highlights and shadows individually.
Not sure what’s going on with your 70-200. You have the IS turned on, yes? It’s a damn near perfect lens at 100mm f/10 and not bad at f/8 or f/5.6. The long and short ends of that lens tend to loose a little detail, but not so much as to be objectionable for stills. Maybe something else is going on? The images I get out of the lens do tend to get mushy at 200mm f/2.8.
S.
S. Allman, Thanks for the feedback. The reason I’m shooting TV for stills is so I can just turn the dial 2 clicks to go from video to stills. I’m shooting in an extremely dynamic environment and things are happening very fast. If I spend too much time fooling around with settings I’ll miss the shot. Today I flew with two 5Ds – one was set up for video with an external monitor strapped to my knee board. The other was set up for stills (in manual mode). I had the 70-200 on the video camera and a 24-70 on the still camera. This was the best setup I’ve shot with so far. Everything came out great. I kept the still camera strapped to my other leg and would just put the video camera in my lap when I wanted to shoot stills.
I’m going to shoot some tests on Monday to try and figure out what’s going on with the exposure on the 70-200.
Hi Matt
Sounds like you have some real fun in your shoots. Not as fast as jets, but I’ve shot quite a bit during sailing races. That can be a cramped, fast changing environment too. When switching between video/ stills I take advantage of the custom settings on the camera dal. I prep the camera for the scene – WB, picture setting, ISO, shutter and initial aperture, and save the video settings to C1, and the corresponding set for stills to C2 with the higher shutter speed, etc. that makes for better stills.
The tough thing though is the ND. Sometimes the best ND for video is not for stills. I typically shoot with a P size matte box, so I need a spot to quickly stash the ND if I choose to pull it. A shirt with big enough chest pockets has worked best so far. Still working on it though. Nice to see the water white in screw ons. I’ve been using them in 4×5 for a bit, and wished they were available in screw ons. Thanks Shane!
Bill
Thanks for the input, Bill. Sounds like your shoots are pretty fun too. I’ve toyed around with the custom settings a bit but, as with manual mode, the fast changes in lighting conditions (like flying above and below the clouds) make it too difficult to adjust the settings fast enough to get a decent shot off. I think my best bet is to go with 2 cameras – one set up for video and one for stills. This is what I was doing before I got a 5D anyway only the video camera was an EX1. I did some tests this week with the 70-200 and came to the conclusion that that lens is just not good for stills in an F16. I had a couple of our other photogs fly with it and they came back with the same results. Still images come out ghosted and blurry and if you use any kind of ND filter it stops it down too much and images come out dark. It’s weird because shooting video with this lens looks awesome. For some reason it doesn’t like shooting stills through the canopy.
Hey Shane, I’m currently using a Fader ND that adjusts the amount of stops. I’m sure it affects the color of the footage, but I need to be able to adjust it on the fly rather than twisiting filters on and off. Do you have any recommendations? Is Tiffen considering a variable ND filter? Thanks!
Andrew, I asked the same question at the bottom of this entry.
He doesn’t recommend Fader ND’s currently.
Multiple times, I have read Shane not recommending Fader variable ND but what about Tiffen’s? Shane, have you tried Tiffen Variable ND? Thanks! :)
http://www.amazon.com/Tiffen-77VND-VARIABLE-FILTER-Camera/dp/B004Z55VP0/ref=pd_sim_sbs_p_1
Noah, the fader ND from Tiffen is double polas, eliminating all sheen and life to a person’s skin. Do not use these. There is one company that is making one that doesn’t do this but will not be production for awhile. I will get you the name. The price is 550.00 for one 77mm.
I have bought a set of the INDIE PLUS and yes these NDs rock!… especially for fiction. However when I am in a documentary set up, the Vari ND would be a big plus. Did you find the name of the company which Vari Pola you recommend (per your mention right above).
A variable ND that doesn’t polarize and eliminate sheen? Exactly what I need when shooting cars! Any new info on this? Thanks!
Shane, are you talking about the Heliopan fader that doesn’t suppress reflections ?
Thanks
Hall, no, I like that one. I am talking about all the other ones that are dueling pola’s that cancel all reflection.
Cool, I’ll go for the heliopan then. thx for the fast answer!
Hey Shane,
I have the Canon 85mm f1.8 that requires and a 58mm filter and a Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 that requires a 67mm filter, I would like to know if there is a way to use white water filters (preferably the sheet filters rather than screw ons) with the lens I have. What is your suggested solution for me?
Cheers
Cody Packer, step up and step down rings are your friends. I have all different lens mm in my arsenal and all are adapted to 77mm as the constant. The minute you start trying to appease every lens diameter with ND you are screwed. Make it a constant and that is why I have designed the 77mm screw ons.
Shane could you use the 77 mm filter on lens with 82mm barrel like the 16 35 or the 24 t/s? I’m affraid of vignetting
Or perhaps it is better to use the pro kit with a small carry on filter like this one : https://www.schneideroptics.com/ecommerce/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?CID=466&IID=7622?
I don’t like to use big matte box, so I’m seeking for a more deescret solution.
Federico, everyone of those lenses can be adapted with step up or step down rings so that 77mm screw ons are king. You have the nice belt pouch that houses all of your water white glass and you are set.
I was just worried about vignetting on bigger lens than 77 mm, but I’m gonna try the indie pro!
And are you gonna make a set also of 52 mm for drop in filter? or it’s better to use 4×5 filter in front of big white lens?
Federico, those are being made as we speak. Soon to be released. The 77mm will not vignette on most of the wide lenses. Take a Zeiss 18mm for an example. This has a 82mm ring and I use a step down ring to 77mm and it doesn’t vignette.
Thank you! I am anxious to purchase the product(s) and you’ve specifically addressed my concern regarding that particular Zeiss lens. Your gracious input on all matters DSLR is simply overwhelming and much appreciated.
I was wondering how do these filters compare to the normal set that Tiffen offers for $119.95:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/674665-REG/Tiffen_77NDK3_77mm_Digital_Neutral_Density.html
Is there a slight color change with these filters?
Thanks
Joseph, yes there are green, brown, grey color shifts with these filters. The reason for the Water White glass and the clean ND cocktail was to give you the most color correction latitude in your limited 8 BIT compressed Canon color space. These WW ND’s give you that.
Hello Shane,
I’m an Videographer/asspiring cinematographer working in the EU (mostly in UK and Sweden) I’m wondering if you know where to get the Tiffen IRND here in the EU. I’m Shooting/Directing a feature this summer and really want to work with the best stuff, but I can’t seem to find a retailer for the Tiffen IRND’s anyware near me.
If you don’t know any retailer would you kindly like to put me in contact with someone at Tiffen that I could discuss the issue with, an that would be able to help me out?
Best Wishes/
Johan B
Dear Johan,
Thank you for your interest in Tiffen filters. Hurlbut Visuals has passed your email to me so I may assist you in finding a retailer in the EU for Tiffen IRND filters. Most of our European orders ship directly from our UK office. I will enquire with them and should have an answer for you by tomorrow morning (EST).
Please confirm you are looking for the 77MM IRND Kits. Now Johan I want to make sure that you need the IR ND, because this is a personal preference thing. I have shot with the WWIR ND’s and WW ND’s. This is what I find. I love golden skin tones and the IR’s give you that. The WW ND’s don’t effect the color in any way and deliver a cleaner image. I use both at all times.
Thanks and I’ll be in touch soon.
Thank you Shane for clareifing this, In that case I belive it is the straight WW ND’s that my interest lies with at this time.
Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions, highly appreciated :)
/Johan B
And the last question is what other filter do you recommend for a nice kit other than nd and a polarizer? the pro mist? I’ve never used any filter so i have the idea a little bit confused
thanks for the great help shane!
Federico, I mainly use just these. If I want an old antique look I use the Tiffen Antique Suede filters, if I want a cyan look, I will use the Harrison Blues. I am not a big pro mist guy, I would rather use smoke diffusion in the room. I find that treating the 5D like reversal film stock is the best way to go about your approach. What you see is what you get to some extent.
Photographer, soon to come film maker on a budget. Fantastic filters, but also fantastically expensive. I’ll modify my Lee filter system to fit the thicker tiffen to use with my EF 16-35L. I could practically buy an EOS 550D (additional camera) for the price of a 6×4 water white. OUCH!
Terence Kearns, the INDIE and the INDIE pro 77mm WW ND series screw on kit we are making fairly affordable.
I have a 77mm IR ND 1,2 and 1.5 Tiffen and they gave me an amazing results! But I`m planning to get a mattebox and I can´t to find a 4×5,65 ND filters kit or pack labeled ” Pro Plus Tiffen” at BH or Samy, so, aren`t launched yet? Thks a lot shane!
Arturo, I am having Jill Conrad my contact at Tiffen check into this and get back to you. Thanks
FilmTools.com has them.
http://www.filmtools.com/tiffen-hot-mirror-irnd-03to21-filter-4×5650-w456hmirnd.html
I love B&H but they do not carry everything! :)
Shane,
I have set of Zeiss ZE lenses (21mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm & 100mm) I was wondering if tiffen has all these sizes to fit for these lenses in the circular ND. WWIR or WW. or is it better to just go 4×4? Thanks.
Shane,
Is this the exact kit that you use. I wanted to be sure before I purchased this. Also Since its only 77mm circular is there a way to fit these on my other Zeiss ZE lenses with different thread size?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/729154-REG/Tiffen_W77INDPROKT_77mm_Indie_Pro_Infrared_Neutral.html
Steve, all the 77mm work on the entire line of Zeiss ZE primes. All you have to do is step up or step down your lens diameter. None of them will vignette. One filter kit does it all.
Steve, I have both sets but would recommend the straight ND’S. They will serve you well. The Tiffen HV Indie and Indie Pro WW ND series. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=tiffen+hv+kits&N=0&InitialSearch=yes
Shane. I just wanted to get the final yes from you. Since Seattle is not a sunny state I was wondering if this set is solid to start with. Thanks.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/729107-REG/Tiffen_W77INDNDKT_77mm_Indie_Neutral_Density.html
Steve, Yes that is the correct set, rock it out my friend.
These WW ND’s Rock Shane :-).I just read your comment about no vignetting in all Zeiss. I was a bit worried when I purchased the step down for 21mm ZE 82-77mm. The camera store told me it wasn’t smart to do it it will vignette massively stepping down from 82mm-77mm with my WW ND’s.
steve, I am so glad that you love them. It works so well, no vignette.
Hi Shane,
Shooting stills for a wedding coming up. Just wondering what you think of using Auto ISO , Auto White balance and Auto focus on a $200 point and shoot Olympus camera. Don’t really know much about photography but it seems to work… any tips on what would make my photos better?? Only comment is that my photos seem to have no field depth and are really really white and bright. Any help please, my shoot is in 5 days!
Thanks Shane, your my Idol!
Basil Jones, it seems like your camera might be on aperture priority, which means it will always give you the shallowest depth of field. If you photos are bright as well I would see if there is a picture style portrait. This will be great for CU of the Bride and Groom. There probably another picture style called landscape. This would be great for wide shots. See if this helps.
I cant seem to find the indi plus HV package on B&h. Anyone have a link to it?
Darren, try film tools. They seem to have a full line.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/729107-REG/Tiffen_W77INDNDKT_77mm_Indie_Neutral_Density.html
Is this the kit you are looking for?
Shane-
These filter packs look great- but they don’t include an IR component in the filter, so what are you doing to battle the IR contamination of the heavy ND load on the 5D/7D?
I’ve got a set of the Tiffen Water White IR ND’s in 77mm for my Canon lenses, but I need a set for my 4×5.65 mattebox for my CP.2 lenses, and this kit looked to be the answer until I realized there isn’t any IR cut.
So what are you doing about IR when using these? Using a Hot Mirror? Something else??
Thanks for the info Shane, I look forward to hearing what your recipe is.
Regards,
Jason
Jason, I am not finding any IR contamination in all of my tests. The IR filter on the sensor seems to be far superior to all of the high end HD cams. The only time I am using the IR’s is in pools and if I want a golden skin tone.
I hate to engage in shameless fawning but out of sheer gratitude I can’t help it dude you are kick ass! Kind of like that movie, which one are you?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1250777/
Thanks again for the invaluable info!
Shane,
How do the Tiffen filters in this new kit perform when used for photography with the 5D or other Canon photo camera? Would it better to invest in a different kit strictly for photographic work?
Thanks for your time and all you do for the community.
Oscar, these kits rock whether its film, 5D, ALexa, or the RED. I was just up in Montreal on Kin and I used them on all of my film work as well as my 5D footage.
Thanks for the reply Shane.
How does the performance/quality, for this kit specific, translate for use in still photography? Would a different Tiffen glass type be better suited for still photographic work?
Keep up the great work.
Oscar, with your RAW file in still photography you can get away with much cheaper glass, so have at whatever one you can afford. The Tiffen is more for HD video in the camera.
Hi Shane, embarrassingly I’m still new to the concept of using filters other than ND. After reading your post, I’m eager to get the WW filters but are there any other filters I should get also eg. Polarizing etc?
If I shoot with the 7D, will the Tiffen WW filters work as well?
Looking forward to your advice.
Shane,
First of all, THANK YOU SO MUCH for all the info that you help us all with!! You rock!!
Second of all, thank you for working to produce these ND filters. Very needed. I wasted quite a few shoots and money and time trying even the high end fader NDs and they sucked – soft, ugly haze, etc. Waste.
I just bought both sets of your filters and while I don’t see any softening problems (thank Vishnu…), I have found an inconsistent color shift in them between green and magenta. I wish that they were all one way, but they are not. Some are green and some are magenta. Not huge, but they are certainly there. The set I got is not the IR ones, because you recommended that we get these.
What to do? I live in Singapore and I ordered them all the way from FilmTools in LA (B&H didn’t have the right price on them, I think there was an error in their website, charging $900 for one set!!). Suggestions?
Thanks,
Alexander
Singapore
Shane,
We did more tests on the ND HV filters today, the non-IR set. Definite color shifts as follows:
0.3 neutral
0.6 neutral
0.9 neutral
1.2 green cast
1.5 neutral
1.8 magenta cast
2.1 strong magenta cast
I’m glad at least that the casts are colors that are fairly easy to compensate for in color correction (unlike a muddy brown or such from the fader NDs that I had before) but they are certainly there. Have you encountered these casts at all? Any suggestions as to what to do about them?
Thank you again for sharing your knowledge with us all.
Alexander
Singapore
I am looking for the correct set in B and H , do you have a specific link to the specific set of filter you are talking about here, thank you
Shane have you tried the vari nd from tiffen?
http://www.2filter.com/faq/tiffen/TiffenVNDcamerafilters.html
how it is? I was taking the indie kit but maybe I can use only one filter, it could be more run and gun
federico, the vari ND is 2 pola’s that you rotate to get your desired stop. Pola’s are not a good thing for skin tones. It takes the reflection out of their skin which makes people look matte and dead. Buy the straight ND’s, it is the best filmmaking approach.
Shane,
I’m so appreciative of the info you post. Heaven knows I’d had terrible results with vari NDs. So I went to B&H’s website, excited to buy the Tiffen 77mm Indie Pro IR/ND filter kit.
But I hesitated because of a recently posted a comment by a Greg G. from Baltimore, particularly because of what he said you told him. Here are his comments from the customer review section (the links were removed by B&H):
“I bought this pack thinking it was the same kit that shane recommended here [@]But it turns out after talking to shane he even says avoid the ir filters because of the green color shift see the following article[@] found i had to reduce the greens on my 5d by 5 in the white balance offset section of the control panel.”
Can you address and clarify here? Huge thanks in advance. I’m in desperate need of solid ND filter with no color shift or loss of sharpness.
Kind regards,
Manahi
Reel Story Films, New York
Manahi, I am going to clear it up for you. Do not use IR at all with the Canon 5D. It has a IR filter on its sensor that is very good. No Need for IR filtration. Buy the HV Indie WW ND kits, if it doesn’t have HV, which stands for Hurlbut Visuals, then it is not the right kit. Thanks and so sorry for the confusion.
Thanks so much for the clarification, Shane! I really appreciate your prompt reply, and the wealth of testing backed info you provide.
All the best,
Manahi
Manahi, not a problem. Thank you!!
thanks for the great info shane! Would you know if the t2i/t3i and 7d aps-c dslrs have this IR filter like the 5d?
Amos Kim, I know the 7D has it. Not sure about the others.
Hey Shane, I just received your Indie Plus HV to use in bright midday sun with wide open aperture. So far, I’m very pleased! One concern is the nylon pouch that tiffen supplies with the filters… Should I be concerned about scratching the glass as I frequently insert+remove filters from the pouch, rubbing against the nylon lining? And if occasional dust gets on the lining?
thx again.
amos kin, I am glad you are pleased with the kit. No, we have not had nay problems with scratching with the nylon pouch. Unless you are dumping dirt and fine rocks in there you should be all good.
Hey Shane thank you soo much for all the knowledge just ordered
Tiffen 77mm Indie Neutral Density Filter Kit (0.3, 0.6, 0.9, 1.2 ND Filters) I’m so excited now can’t wait to try them on..
Didier Clermount, that is great. Do enjoy. Would love feedback on them.
Wow!!! Shane those ND’s are insane no color shifting, no resolution lost amazing… Gonna use them on a music video shoot this month. Would you recommend an IR filter on my set? & what other filters are useful to get rid of flaring, glaring ect.. when shooting outdoors in the sun? Trying to keep the image sharp… or is it just because I don’t have a Mattebox. Thank you once again for helping us take care.
GOD Bless
Didier Clermont, you are very welcome. I am glad that you like them. I think they are the bomb. Tiffen rocked it out on this line of WW ND’s. I find that I use the IR’s occasionally. Found when shooting in pools or the ocean, I like what they did for the skin tones, other than that I find that I need a little IR when I am in the 1.8 to 2.1 range, but never what Tiffen has added into their filters. It is like a special cocktail to get it right. Thanks for your support.
IR’s are not a must got it Shane you clarified everything for me thank you. Now it’s time to go back to shooting, yes those WW ND’s are the bomb!!!
Shane,
I’m a big fan of your propelling efforts – keep up with the great work!
Just one short question: Are the WW NDs designed solely for the 8 Bit color space in video mode? I’d also would like to use them for stills.
Thanks,
Andreas
Andreas, thank you so much for you kind words. Yes the Tiffen WW ND’s will work perfect for stills as well.
Shane,
What is your choice on working indoors? Stay with these ND filters or do you
Shoot differently? Using specific filters or just a uv glass?
Thanks for all you inside tidbits. It sure helps us from reinventing the wheel!
Robert
Hi Shane,
I did a little test with a new set of IRND waterwhite filters:
http://greentreepictures.nl/Tiffen_IRND_test/
Would really appreciate yout thoughts on the color shift I encounter.
hi shane, I jst threw away my ND fader and ordered your 77mm indie kit. I have one quick question…. Can i stack these filters in front each other to get more then 1.2? Any performance loss? will be ok?
Oz glad to hear it.Those faders suck the life out of skin by polarizing them. Yes you can stack the filters without any performance loss.
Hi Shane, by now I am a huge fan of your work, I recently bought Act of Valor on DVD and everytime I see I client hesitate on HDSLR use I show it to them and they are always blown away. Don’t get me wrong, not that I take credit for it (and I know it is the filmmaker and not the camera that makes a film) but it gives incredible confidence in the platform itself. I recently got a 5D Mark III and I have loved it. Also got an Indie Filmmaker ND kit in 77mm and have been totally blown away by the results. It really does understand the DSLR color space better than other filters, and I have since totally discarded vari-NDs. Over the last year I have asked questions mostly regarding lenses, right now I am shooting with a mixed bag of Zeiss ZF.2, Canons, and mostly Nikon AIS glass. I first got a 105mm macro and loved it, then got a 35mm 1.4, and loved it also, so I ended up getting an 18mm, 24mm, and 85mm, all second hand but great.
I just wanted to let you know how great an inspiration you have been to me. You have no idea the increase in quality in the material I have been shooting since I really began to pay close attention to your blog. ManCam (redrock micro at the moment) is by far my favorite setup to operate, with a DP4 monitor, although I know it is not ideal for every situation. All my lenses have step up rings, as you have recommended, turning them into a system.
Now that I have recently bought the Indie ND kit, again I am blown away by your sound advice, and I just used them for the first time for an ESPN polo event in Colombia. I loved the results. So once again, thanks for sharing all this information.
Ruben Fernandez, WOW!!!! thank you so much for all of this. Your kind words are much appreciated. I am so glad that the Man Cam and the Tiffen Indie ND set is working out for your. Those Nikon AIS series is off the hook. I love that glass a little yellow and creamy.
Here I am rocking it at the ESPN polo meet. 5D Mark III on ManCam with SmallHD DP4 Monitor, Tokina 11-16mm 2.8, and I think I had the 0.9 HV WW ND. Note the card stickers on the side of the camera, also taken from Shane’s etiquette method. https://twitter.com/#!/DSLRista/media/slideshow?url=pic.twitter.com%2FVA0iHl12
Ruben Fernandez, sweet rig, thanks for the pics and all your support
Hi, just writing to thank you for your advice on this great product. I ended up getting the two sets of Indie ND’s and I’m stoked. These filters are solid. Best NDs I’ve used so far on the 5d. Thanks again! Good work
Carlos, that is great news, I am glad you like them. I think they rock as well. Good color
Hi shane,
Thanks for your efford here! I am actor and starting with a lumix GH-3 and a voigtländer nokton 25 mm and a slr magic 12 mm.
The guys from slr magic told me that i need a step up to 77 mm to avoid vignette. The lense has a size of 58 mm. Is it really neccessary to take 77 mm filters or would 67mm enough?
Then i searched for ND filters. Because it is more comfortable i would prefer a variable ND filter. But i dont want to eliminate all reflections. And what i got so far it is not possible to get a variable ND which is really working as a ND. The change color, sharpness and contrast. But how big is that issue with my setup? Maybe this is for professional people more important. What do you think?
Do I need IR with my GH-3?
Here is a test of variable NDs. He says it is al right.
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=nECdBiu5Rrw&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DnECdBiu5Rrw
Thx for advice!
Hello Shane,
I’m wondering if this ND filter works well with nikon since it was made specifically for canon 5d?i’m not familiar with the canon system or the color space. However, I mainly shoot still portraits with strobes. I have been trying to find more reviews for this ND filter, but can’t seem to find it. It would greatly appreciate if you could give some feedbacks or send some sample pics taken with a nikon fullframe camera to my email.
sorry, i forgot to mention the lens focal range, which i mainly use the 85mm and the 70-200mm for portrait shooting.
thank you
regards
Adi
Adi, these filters were designed for DSLR’s RGB color space. They will work perfectly with your Nikon camera.
Shane,
I recently got into the HDSLR scene. I have been shooting stills for a couple of years now, that’s the reason I own 4 Canon L lenses. What I was considering for filters were the WW Tiffen ND ones with a filter holder system (eg Lee) and adapter rings for the different lenses. I have a couple filters at the moment (screw ins) but was looking for a one fits all solution.
What’s your point of view on this?
Aristotelis, Tiffen Indie Kit and the Tiffen Indie Plus are your answer. This will get you all set up.
Hi Shane,
thanks for this valuable info on ND filtering!
I’m willing to upgrade form a fader type variable ND to solid ones and I’m looking at at least the 2.1 WW or maybe the Indie Pro HV kit.
The thing that confuses me a bit is that when I set my lens to say an aperture of 4.0 (5dmkIII) in bright outdoors, I have to turn my fader ND close to 8 stops of filtration to be able to expose with 1/50 and ISO 160 correctly. Also considering the sunny 16 rule this kind of matches.
But you mention that with 7 stops filtration you could go up to f/2.0 in sunny outdoors? Maybe my fader ND is not accurate but I just kind of want to be sure that a 2.1 (7 stops) ND filter will be enough to get a nice shallow depth of field and keep shutter at 1/50. I’d rather get a little underexposed because at least then I could raise the ISO to 320, 640, no problem with the 5dmkIIII.
Any tips highly appreciated! Thanks for your outstanding contribution to indie and hobbyist filmmakers.
Best regards,
Nuksu
(Indie Plus HV was what I meant that I would get)
Nuksu,you are very welcome and I am glad I could help. Yes the HV indie kit is perfect. What I meant was X on the IRND Fader was 10 stops not seven and that got me to a 2.0 on the BMCC, which I found cinematic. Hope this helps
Shane, thanks for the reply. Yeah I watched the Fader IRND presentation and it seems sweet that you can go up to 10 stops without problems.
The thing I actually tried to refer to was from this page upon the launch of the HV kits where it says:
“Tiffen has engineered them to give you 7 stops worth of ND so that you can shoot the Canon 5D in the blazing sun at F 2.0 if you would like.”
So that just left me wondering if 7 stops of filtration is enough in sunny daylight to open all the way to f/2.0 if you want to maintain 1/50 shutter? Not that 2.8 and even 4.0 aren’t already very cinematic on the 5D and leave a chance to focus :)
Nuksu, yes on a Canon 5D MK II or III at 160 ISO you will be at a 2.0 in the blazing sun with 7 stops of ND. The Fader IR ND is a new Tiffen product designed specifically for the BMCC, bot anything else. The HV kits are the best for the Canon line.
Shane, thanks a ton for your reply! I’ll be getting the HV plus kit then.
Nuksu, wonderful,good choice
Hi Shane, do you have any advice on getting these in Europe? Would be really appreciated.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/729107-REG/Tiffen_W77INDNDKT_77mm_Indie_Neutral_Density.html
Thanks,
Andrea
Andrea, I am on it and contacting Tiffen now. Thanks for the support
Hey Shane,
Thank you for a great idea and product!
I’m shooting 5D3 with ZE lenses.
In the world of ND filters, nothing comes close in price and quality.
One question though, do you think it would work with clip-on lite matte box?
The route would be:
1) step up my ZE’s to 77mm
2) add the needed circular ND
3) add the lens adaptor ring to the ND filter for matte box (77 to 95 back opening, comes with matte box)
4) clip on the matte box
Would it work or do you think there’s to many stages?
I don’t mind if it takes little more time. It’s the price/quality that’s important.
Lite matte box adds one french flag with low weight and cost, and also 4×4 tray for vari-ND if needed.
P.S. Any ideas where I could buy the 77mm Indie Kit in Europe?
Cheers,
T
Hi Shane,
Have you tested or had any experience using these with the RED Epic/ Dragon/ Weapon? OR would you recommend using a hot mirror and using a straight ND behind the HM which is what I typically do. I own a C300MKII and and very happy with the the built in NDs but I end up shooting RED frequently and I am looking for a set of NDs to invest in…. I use a 3 stage Bright Tangerine MB so I can stack a hot mirror, straight ND and have one stage left for any additional filtration, diffusio, pola,, etc. Curious about your thoughts now that it seems you are shooting RED more and more.
-andrew
I never use Hot Mirrors, they destroy skin tones and are inconsistent. On the RED Dragon sensor I only use True ND’s or the Firecrest ND’s. These are specifically designed to combat the IR pollution and are very consistent.
What’s up mates, nice post and nice urging commented here, I am genuinely enjoying by these.